The perfect lever action.

[IronBeard]

Is still pine over the Marlin 336 .30-30 I was guilt-tripped into selling to someone less fortunate than I, but was able to eventually replace it with two Marlin 1895s. One G and one GS (blued/stainless) in .45-70. Some folks wince in pain when they see/hear .45-70, but I love using a cartridge that has been around so long, and if you reload, it is really versatile. Everything from, "not bad at all," to "I don't wanna shoot that again." I'm down to .45-70s and one Remington 700 -06 in big game rifles. My 1895s shoot tighter groups than my -06. Not bashing -06s, but if I was forced to sell my -06, I'd reinvest the $ into my .45-70 habit, maybe finally replace that 336.

 

[SAWMAN]

Don't forget about the Marlin Outfitter guns. (444Marlin)
My gun still shoots like this and somewhat better with a 265 and 300gr WFNGC from Cast Performance.
Have shot many groups of <.500" with about 5 different bullets including the 180 and 240gr Hornadys. The 180's will damn near cut a coyote in half.
My gun has been equipped with a Leupold 1-4X24 (heavy duplex) for the last 25+ years. ---- SAWMAN

 

[SAWMAN]

You big bore guys should try TRAIL BOSS.
Shooting the heavy bullets really SLOW is great fun. --- SAWMAN

 

[Ron]

If I may add my 2 cents in, the max load and velocity of a load is not always the best load. If you are loading for accuracy, I find that my guns are more accurate using reduced loads under the max data. I have a couple of rifles in the same caliber and I find that they like different loads as each gun is slightly different in what it likes. My Henry 44 mag shoots its best groups using 19 grains of Alliant 2400. The second best load is with 23 grains of W-296. That's not even close to the max loads. Somebody else's gun may not like that load at all. The max load does no good if you can't hit what your aiming at! My favorite 223 loves 23.5 grains of W-748. That is below the max load but it is pin point accurate out to 300 yards and one ragged hole at 100! Sorry if this is off topic. A friend of mine shoots his 45-70 and loves using Trail Boss. That's what his rifle likes!

 

[SAWMAN]

I agree with your above Ron. Most of my guns like up near max or up to 1.0gr over.
I always use mag primers in pistol and rifle. That makes a difference also. I simply changed to mag primers to gain desired accuracy. When switching from regular to magnum I always drop my charge weight by 1.0gr. Typically,I can come back up with some testing. I have also used Fed215 primers in 243Win,308Win,etc,to attain accuracy.
It has been my expierance that the larger the bore,the easier it is to load for. The absolute easiest for me was my 45-90Express. It was in a Ruger #1 action and I got up to 4.5grs over book max ... with desired accuracy. ---- SAWMAN

 

[M118LR]

I agree with your above Ron. Most of my guns like up near max or up to 1.0gr over.
I always use mag primers in pistol and rifle. That makes a difference also. I simply changed to mag primers to gain desired accuracy. When switching from regular to magnum I always drop my charge weight by 1.0gr. Typically,I can come back up with some testing. I have also used Fed215 primers in 243Win,308Win,etc,to attain accuracy.
It has been my expierance that the larger the bore,the easier it is to load for. The absolute easiest for me was my 45-90Express. It was in a Ruger #1 action and I got up to 4.5grs over book max ... with desired accuracy. ---- SAWMAN

I have found that straight walled cases are always the easiest to reload. In days gone by Lyman used to denote which loads they found to be most accurate, and most of those left a little +/- before edging on the Max.
But in all honesty I know more folks that drag out the Old 30-30 a week prior to Opening Day, and if the first round down range matches last years point of aim/impact, well the only other shot's fired are afield. Some Old Boy's are even proud to only expend a box of 20 rounds in ten years. Some will find that they prefer factory loaded ammo in tube loaded lever actions. Roll crimping and a channelure, which is the preferred method for tube loaded ammo, add time and tool costs; and with so few rounds expended yearly I can follow why they use only factory ammo.
A few of the Old Tyme cartridges are becoming so scarce as to almost be reloading only options. The afore mentioned .348 Win instantly comes to mind, and since Hornady has discontinued it's 265 grain .430 flat point the writing is on the wall for the .444 Marlin.

So perhaps the "Perfect Lever Action" should be chambered for time tested cartridges like the 30-30, 45-70, or .308 Win? They may not be perfect cartridges, but they should be available almost anyplace.

 

[Telum Pisces]

I have found that straight walled cases are always the easiest to reload. In days gone by Lyman used to denote which loads they found to be most accurate, and most of those left a little +/- before edging on the Max.
But in all honesty I know more folks that drag out the Old 30-30 a week prior to Opening Day, and if the first round down range matches last years point of aim/impact, well the only other shot's fired are afield. Some Old Boy's are even proud to only expend a box of 20 rounds in ten years. Some will find that they prefer factory loaded ammo in tube loaded lever actions. Roll crimping and a channelure, which is the preferred method for tube loaded ammo, add time and tool costs; and with so few rounds expended yearly I can follow why they use only factory ammo.
A few of the Old Tyme cartridges are becoming so scarce as to almost be reloading only options. The afore mentioned .348 Win instantly comes to mind, and since Hornady has discontinued it's 265 grain .430 flat point the writing is on the wall for the .444 Marlin.

So perhaps the "Perfect Lever Action" should be chambered for time tested cartridges like the 30-30, 45-70, or .308 Win? They may not be perfect cartridges, but they should be available almost anyplace.

In 45-70 there's just so many options when it comes to reloading for that round. You almost can't go wrong with any bullet or powder charge for that round. I call them mouse farts for the very low recoil loads. It makes it to where my 7 year old can shoot the rifle. And then I can throw in a hot load that will knock back the largest of individuals with the recoil.

 

[poppop]

winchester mdl 88 in .243
nuff said

 

[M118LR]

In 45-70 there's just so many options when it comes to reloading for that round. You almost can't go wrong with any bullet or powder charge for that round. I call them mouse farts for the very low recoil loads. It makes it to where my 7 year old can shoot the rifle. And then I can throw in a hot load that will knock back the largest of individuals with the recoil.

There will be many that feel twice price of 30-30 ammo per round might make the 45-70 less of an option, especially if sub 300 lb non-dangerous game is the primary critter. JMHO.

 

[J pace]

winchester mdl 88 in .243
nuff said

I agree with you 100% just picked up this 88 to match my model 100. Both are in 243

 

[J pace]

Just one more of my obsessions acquiring guns to match the ones I already have. Hey that sounds like a good idea for a new post

 

[Telum Pisces]

There will be many that feel twice price of 30-30 ammo per round might make the 45-70 less of an option, especially if sub 300 lb non-dangerous game is the primary critter. JMHO.

With factory ammo, it can get expensive. If I purchase a new rifle or handgun these days, I always factor in and buy the reloading components for it if I don't already have the components. While I still shoot and maintain an inventory of factory ammo for all my guns, I want to make sure I can reload for every caliber that I own. I got 60 pieces of 45-70 brass prepped and all primed up ready to load the other day.

Reloading is not a way to save money as it is to make sure I have the ability to keep the rounds available. I have some bullets that I like to call my lipstick rounds too.

45-70 is definitely not the cheapest round to shoot. But I like the fact that I could take down an elephant with a 500 grain projectile or load it down with a 300 grain projectile for deer. If you reload, the ability for one rifle to take almost all medium to large game is possible.

But holy crap, I just looked at some of the available factory 45-70 loads. $3 - $6 per round is freaking crazy!!!!

 

[SAWMAN]

With the prices and availability of MOST ammo nowadays it is baffling to me whay more people do not reload.
In the last 6-8 years of so,I have added a whole bunch of chamberings to my list of "reloaders only. This,includes the 4570,500S&W,444Marlin,454Casull,and a ton of others.
Heard a guy bitchin' the other day at Mike's gunshop,about the availability and cost of the 7WSM. I told him that I had some bullets and appropriate powders if he needed some. He promply stated that he did not reload.
WTF !! --- SAWMAN

 

[Ron]

With the prices and availability of MOST ammo nowadays it is baffling to me whay more people do not reload.
In the last 6-8 years of so,I have added a whole bunch of chamberings to my list of "reloaders only. This,includes the 4570,500S&W,444Marlin,454Casull,and a ton of others.
Heard a guy bitchin' the other day at Mike's gunshop,about the availability and cost of the 7WSM. I told him that I had some bullets and appropriate powders if he needed some. He promply stated that he did not reload.
WTF !! --- SAWMAN

I might be a little strange but to me reloading is just as much a hobby as shooting. I try and go to the range at least twice a week and I shoot a lot of several different calibers while I am there. Reloading is the only way that I can afford to do that. Granted I did buy all my reloading supplies before the pandemic crap started. I learned my lesson back around 2013 when there was a big primmer shortage. Won't get caught with my pants down again like I did back then! Lesson learned!
PS... Reloading is much more accurate than factory ammo if done correctly!

 

[SAWMAN]

Agreed.
But why in the hell are some "smart people" and "tactical" types so damn hard headed ?? ---- SAWMAN

 

[M118LR]

Agreed.
But why in the hell are some "smart people" and "tactical" types so damn hard headed ?? ---- SAWMAN

Well I ain't that smart, and their are folks that consider themselves way more "Tactical", but I'll confess to being hardheaded. Yet the only time I find myself at the reloading bench is when I require more accuracy from my firearm than Commercial endeavors seem to be able to supply. Yet I have yet to find that my time was better spent at the reloading bench unless it was competition driven inside of 300 yards. Now if we need to make a single hole with a .223 at 100 yards I may once again find myself spending time at the reloading bench, I'll be hand measuring 21.5 grains of of IMR4198 and topping it off with a #2265 55 grain Spire Point Hornady in a fire formed case. But the time spent on the reloading bench isn't worth my effort afield inside of 300 yards. JMHO.
Just how many rounds do Y'all expend afield nowadays?

 

[Telum Pisces]

Just how many rounds do Y'all expend afield nowadays?

For hunting or target shooting?

I am a little unusual for my hunting rifles. I enjoy shooting them. So every year, I will check them 2-3 times through the season. I used to send 3-4 boxes of ammo down range in each one of those sessions per each rifle. So 60-80 rounds per caliber. Now I am only shooting the minimum to check or sight it in perfectly.

In these times, I probably only go through a box for the season. In my lever gun (45-70) the recoil actually helps me save ammo. If it was a 30-30 or some other caliber, I'd probably shoot more!

 

[M118LR]

For hunting or target shooting?

I am a little unusual for my hunting rifles. I enjoy shooting them. So every year, I will check them 2-3 times through the season. I used to send 3-4 boxes of ammo down range in each one of those sessions per each rifle. So 60-80 rounds per caliber. Now I am only shooting the minimum to check or sight it in perfectly.

In these times, I probably only go through a box for the season. In my lever gun (45-70) the recoil actually helps me save ammo. If it was a 30-30 or some other caliber, I'd probably shoot more!

Target Shooting is done on the one way range, that isn't afield.
Perhaps shooting afield is done only while hunting Nowadays?
Paper targets are not the same as Game Afield, but I suspect that paper targets are more easily shot and can be repeated more often than game afield Nowadays.
Just how many times a year do you stand up and fire rounds like you would afield for simple practice? Perhaps ten times out of ten times on paper equals one time for one time afield on an actual game animal? JMHO.

We practice on paper to make sure that we can do afield on the only chance we have to produce Game in the Freezer! JMHO.

 

[Ron]

Well I ain't that smart, and their are folks that consider themselves way more "Tactical", but I'll confess to being hardheaded. Yet the only time I find myself at the reloading bench is when I require more accuracy from my firearm than Commercial endeavors seem to be able to supply. Yet I have yet to find that my time was better spent at the reloading bench unless it was competition driven inside of 300 yards. Now if we need to make a single hole with a .223 at 100 yards I may once again find myself spending time at the reloading bench, I'll be hand measuring 21.5 grains of of IMR4198 and topping it off with a #2265 55 grain Spire Point Hornady in a fire formed case. But the time spent on the reloading bench isn't worth my effort afield inside of 300 yards. JMHO.
Just how many rounds do Y'all expend afield nowadays?

I reload for the cost savings. My cost is about 25% of the NORMAL retail price to buy the ammo. I shoot 50 rds per week per caliber per range visit. So I shoot around 500 rds per week on average. I try and go to the range at least twice a week. I only shoot paper targets to sight in a scope otherwise I shoot steel plates. 22 LR, 9 mm, 38 spl, 357 mag, 44 mag, 45 acp and 45LC at 30 yards. I shoot my Henry 44 mag, my T/C Contender 223 and my Savage Axis II 223 at 100 yards. I also shoot my Savage Axis II 223 at 200 and 300 yards. I also shoot both of my 22lr rifles at 100 yards. I have other guns but they might only go once a month on average. I have a 22 suppressor so I shoot a lot of 22 LR. As a matter of fact I am all loaded up right now for my range visit tomorrow am. I hope to meet and see you all at the range. Anyone who knows me will tell you that I'm always letting people shoot my guns to see if it might be something that they might be interested in! A lot of people have shot one of my guns then gone out and bought one. I see it as getting people active in the sport! Plus it helps people to decide if it might be a gun or caliber that they might be interested in! Helps prevent buyers remorse! That's how I decided on most of my firearms by trying out somebody else's. Here is a pic of 2 of my favorites. To many to list..

 

[Ron]

Agreed.
But why in the hell are some "smart people" and "tactical" types so damn hard headed ?? ---- SAWMAN

If you figure that out, let me know!