Your thoughts on this shooting.

[IronBeard]

I think you would have the same issues... certain less desirable types would be drawn to the job/task, just like LE sometimes attracts the wrong personality. In the past, the agencies could easily filter those who exhibit problematic traits (anger management issues, authority complex, those who like to stretch the truth, those who like to dabble in the grey areas, etc.).

Those who slipped through the cracks were soon discovered and moved on down the road, or depending on the severity of the issue, fired. Now days, minor infractions that would have once got you fired are now tolerated. Cops in many places are allowed to "Resign in lieu of Investigation", which means they just go get hired somewhere else.

I'm extremely fortunate as I love my agency, I love the people I work for, I love the guys and gals on my shift, and I really appreciate the community where I work. BUT I HONESTLY HATE MY JOB.

80% of the shift we spend time on things we really shouldn't be involved with. A great deal of time, energy, and effort is spent "problem solving for adults who can't act like adults" vs. conducting activities to actually deter criminal activity.

I've had a great and rewarding career and will try to hang in for another five years so long as the local politics in general and environment stays about the same. Hopefully after Nov 2024 we will start to see a shift back towards the way things used to be.

Yeah, society is what society is. Kinda hard to chnage it quickly. Was just kinda hopin' you might see an option I can't. Totally understand the hate my job thing, and that working with good people can really help, BTDT. Seems like you've picked your point on the horizon. Can't blame/fault you one bit. Keep moving toward it, and good luck.

 

[BluesBrother]

If this should be in a different thread, I apologize. However, the request was for "Your thoughts on this shooting." I have another point of view.​

SAPD Chief William P. McManus has been a chief of police for 21 years in three cities, San Antonio being the largest department. Chief McManus started his law enforcement career in 1975. He served in a variety of street and investigative assignments, and rose through the ranks of Sergeant, Lieutenant, and Captain. Chief McManus holds a Master's Degree in Management from Johns Hopkins. Chief McManus has been in law enforcement almost as long as FJB (1972) has been in Washington DC, imagine that.​

5th San Antonio police officer dies from suicide in last 7 months, experts weigh in: 'Stop the demonization'​

A mental health expert said law enforcement mental health has hit a 'perfect storm'​

You'd think that someone with that much on the job experience and education would know exactly how to recruit and put talented, ready to serve officers on the street and help his remaining officers from committing suicide. IMO

 

[IronBeard]

Good points Blues. Can, should, and will are often worlds apart. As has been pointed out, at least to an extent, they say they have to hire from who applies. Sure, you can weed some out early, but once years and countless $'s have been spent, I'm sure management/government become increasingly hesitant to just kick someone to the curb, as do those who work daily with the individual. Family is family. In the end, yes, management owns it. The buck stops there. Personally, I suspect that senior leadership is a major source of the problems that make the evening news, and this and other forums.

Mental health is a thing, a factor. My experiences are with military psychologists. Not bad people, but their primary goal is to get you back on the job. Why? See the time/$ references above. Do some fall short? Probably. Do some slip through the cracks? Probably. Do guys figure out how to play Doc's game, and get back out there? Yep. Maybe it's the same, maybe not.

 

[FNHman]

I'd like a someone to open my door while I'm parked eating a burger. I'd mag dump in their brain so fast for my life is clearly in danger. Its a shame the kids didn't have a gun to defend himself with against that piece if shit officer.

 

[tatwell]

All ways yes sir and no sir and comply officer wrong but arguing resisting gives bad cop excuse to use force he is wrong you are dead

 

[Combatcarl43]

I mean.. SAPD fired him pretty quick.. My guess is if they couldn't wouldn't defend him its likely not a good shoot. Seems like they didnt even try in this case.

 

[SpeedyJones]

Seems to me that the whole situation shows a significant deficiency in the training the Officer received…

Is that the fault of the Officer or the Agency that trained him?

 

[gnappi]

I'm glad I retired as an electronics geek who always complied with the law and was never arrested

 

[Bowhntr6pt]

Seems to me that the whole situation shows a significant deficiency in the training the Officer received…

Is that the fault of the Officer or the Agency that trained him?

I can assure you, the issue here is not training, the issue is an officer taking stuff personally.

A great percentage of Police misconduct is the result of poor impulse control and cops getting emotionally/personally wrapped up in the situation. Having an authority complex is a part of the problem as well.

When I was a Field Training Officer, one of the first lessons I gave new cops was DON'T EVER TAKE THE JOB PERSONAL. You are going to make good arrests of criminals and the "system" is going to cut them lose... that's not on you. So long as the Judge found Probable Cause at the Initial Appearance, what happens after that isn't on you or a reflection of the quality of the case/arrest. Lawyers play games, that's reality.

The way he snatched the door open and confronted the driver says it all... he was pissed and he was going to have the last word.

ETA- the only thing a cop should take personally is an attack... then it's game on.

 

[SpeedyJones]

I stand by what I said. As a former academy Instructor, a new Officer does what he is trained to do, and doesn't do what he is trained not to do.

Experience changes that, and he had very little experience.

 

[Bowhntr6pt]

I stand by what I said. As a former academy Instructor, a new Officer does what he is trained to do, and doesn't do what he is trained not to do.

Experience changes that, and he had very little experience.

Nothing in any academy I’ve been to, and I’ve been to three, schooled this Guy to do what he did nor failed to teach him what not to do.

From start to finish he demonstrated poor tactics, poor judgment, and a complete lack of impulse control.

I guess we just have to disagree.

 

[Bowhntr6pt]

To clarify I agree experience changes behavior but this was a lack of common sense and application of basic deadly force law.

 

[.22 cents]

https://newtube.app/user/AllTheWorldsAStage/OSI6the

 

[Raven]

I question why body cam footage is immediately blasted all over mainstream news for everyone to become an armchair quarterback. How did they get it and who released it just like that? Or is this just another psychological operation of social engineering? Who knows? I just know how it makes people react and I never trust a damn thing on the news.

He'll never get a fair trial because of all that footage

 

[Raven]

Mental health is a thing, a factor. My experiences are with military psychologists. Not bad people, but their primary goal is to get you back on the job. Why? See the time/$ references above. Do some fall short? Probably. Do some slip through the cracks? Probably. Do guys figure out how to play Doc's game, and get back out there? Yep. Maybe it's the same, maybe not.

I second that

 

[lil'skeet]

I can assure you, the issue here is not training, the issue is an officer taking stuff personally.

A great percentage of Police misconduct is the result of poor impulse control and cops getting emotionally/personally wrapped up in the situation. Having an authority complex is a part of the problem as well.

When I was a Field Training Officer, one of the first lessons I gave new cops was DON'T EVER TAKE THE JOB PERSONAL. You are going to make good arrests of criminals and the "system" is going to cut them lose... that's not on you. So long as the Judge found Probable Cause at the Initial Appearance, what happens after that isn't on you or a reflection of the quality of the case/arrest. Lawyers play games, that's reality.

The way he snatched the door open and confronted the driver says it all... he was pissed and he was going to have the last word.

ETA- the only thing a cop should take personally is an attack... then it's game on.

Seems that one of America's bigger problems are the corrupt judges and DAs that are making society a sh#t hole. I imagine that if you had to answer to them as law enforcement that would probably be a big reason why big cities are turning to sh#t at a record pace. It would be hard to be LEO in one of those hell holes and know most of the citizens hate you & want you dead, and everyone from your chief, lawyer, prosecutor, DA & judge are funded by George Soros.
It seems ALL of the "upper management" needs a good scrutinizing, firing, and new start with people that are well vetted. Chaos helps our rulers out which is why trillions of $ continue to fund it, and things will get worse.
But, it's all by design. Remember a couple long years ago? "Nonessential"
It wasn't our jobs our masters were speaking of.

 

[lil'skeet]

https://newtube.app/user/AllTheWorldsAStage/OSI6the

As far as the tempered glass shattering..... If you have window tint film it will not fall apart. It will usually act as safety glass. He should concentrate on the lack of blood on the kid and lack of bullet holes.
Speaking of, what ever happened to the uvalde, TX "massacre" or the Anne Heche wrecking her car and being hauled off still seemingly alive and fighting?

 

[BluesBrother]

I question why body cam footage is immediately blasted all over mainstream news for everyone to become an armchair quarterback. How did they get it and who released it just like that? Or is this just another psychological operation of social engineering? Who knows? I just know how it makes people react and I never trust a damn thing on the news.

That body cam footage would not be released without the chief's approval. I'd hate to be in a life or death situation with this chief having my back. It fit the narrative of the political chief and drive by media to release for the very reason you sight. They don't want a fair trial. They want people jumping to conclusions and pre judging the officer. Why was he fired immediately? To send the message that the chief thinks he is guilty, soooo, he must be guilty. The reasons are the same. Life is really difficult without the benefit of foresight.

 

[.22 cents]

As far as the tempered glass shattering..... If you have window tint film it will not fall apart. It will usually act as safety glass. He should concentrate on the lack of blood on the kid and lack of bullet holes.
Speaking of, what ever happened to the uvalde, TX "massacre" or the Anne Heche wrecking her car and being hauled off still seemingly alive and fighting?

Yeah man things just dont add up in these tv ‘shootings’. One news channel will say hes shot through the stomach, spleen, lung, liver and another will say shot twice in the head and we cleary can see him rolling around on a stretcher looking like he has to keep a prairie dog from escaping with not a drop of blood on him. Medics in no rush posing for a photo opp lmao its a stage show to me and this is how society is engineered. Distrust and defund the police seems to be the end goal of this one at a time when crime is up, people are broke, inflation is burying people, borders are open, supply chains are threatened with strikes from controlled unions, war is knocking and mainstream now saying the hokey pokey was a bad idea oops. Sounds all like a depopulation plan to me. Just waiting for the next story to be created that leads the herd off a cliff.

 

[Longtooth]

If I remember correctly the officer claimed something directly contradictory to the footage. That was why the footage was released so fast and he was fired.

Its a bad situation all around and Im so thankful my dad saw the way LE was going and told me not to follow in his footsteps.