Model 12 Information Please

[Ahelimech]

I recently inherited this Military Model 12 SN 973xxx. The SN is a 1943 production receiver with US and Flaming Bomb markings with a crossed cannon cartouche and WB on the stock. Of course the matching SN Barrel with Flaming Bomb Ordinance Markings is the one that has been cut and a Multi Choke Co. Dyna Magic multi choke welded on. I guess my question is, how is something like this valued? It also has 2 other Barrel assemblies with one installed as shown. Is there any historical value with the Ordinance marked Barrel being ‘modified’ or is it just a 'shooter'? Thanks in advance for any information or leads to additional resources. I am unfamiliar with Model 12s in general much less one that seems to be somewhat unique.

 

[Tige]

Anything military marked will demand a premium. Are you sure the multi choke was added after? I would recommend research on military shotguns configurations. Either way it’s a great piece. Wonderful inheritance. Hope you take it out to the range and hunt with it

 

[indy1919a4]

At one time I tried to learn these and they are a tough learn. Lots of little things from fakes to after war modifications.. But your serial number looks good. It looks darn good.

Alot of these were modified from their Military configuration after the war and sold through Kleins Sporting Goods.

Also alot of them were never trench guns but were aerial gunner trainers.

Seriously I would take this to a few better collector shows. Try to show it to some dealers who have handled a few of these. It is better that someone who knows these can handle them to judge. Where as you may not get all your questions answered, from their reactions, you will find out some more questions to research on your own.

Nice looking shot gun package there.

Seriously these make Spruce Winchesters look easy to authenticate.

 

[Ahelimech]

I have tried doing a little research on my own and it looks like it is going to be a project. I have also found that some were used at on base skeet ranges or loaned out through MWR type places. I will see if I can find some Klien Sporting good ads or catalogues. May get lucky. Thanks.

 

[indy1919a4]

This ad is from 1958.. You can see these were not cheap.. Thats almost 600 dollars in todays dollars.

 

[Ahelimech]

It appears as though all of those have been fitted with a new 'not winchester' barrel. That may be what the top barrel is off of. It has no markings at all visible or a SN stamp like the Winchester Barrels.

 

[Rebel_Rider1969]

This ad is from 1958.. You can see these were not cheap.. Thats almost 600 dollars in todays dollars.

View attachment 162808

Ya mean ya send them cash and they mail you a gun? How did the ever keep the streets clean? Love the S&W with the lanyard.

 

[indy1919a4]

Ya mean ya send them cash and they mail you a gun? How did the ever keep the streets clean? Love the S&W with the lanyard.

I do not know, to look at the S&W s you have look pass those 30 dollar k98s & 20 dollar Jungle carbines and those boss ten dollar Parkas.

 

[DAS HUGH!]

Yep they're worth a good bit when they're stamped. Not sure how much tho when tinkered with. I have a rare one also. A Heavy Duck ribbed barrel. But it too has been cut to 18 inches. But I love it that way so it don't bug me. One thing u should know tho is these guns will slamfire. A great feature imo but one you must be aware of when operating it

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[DAS HUGH!]

If I was you tho I'd research what the bomb marked reciever ends are selling for. Then you have at least that much worth in it. As far as the barrel end, then yeah it may be a wash. I managed to snag mine at 450$ I think like a year ago. Which is a crazy good price for a heavy duck 3 inch ribbed model. But it shows how much the value depends on if it's unaltered tho. And who's selling it, and so on. I lucked up and got mine from a down to earth guy. But online, the sky is the limit with these things. So you never know. The bomb models are so sought after that there's actually alot of fakes floating around I've heard. So you'll have to sort that out too perhaps. Nice gun tho and good luck

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[indy1919a4]

I managed to snag mine at 450$ I think like a year ago. Which is a crazy good price for a heavy duck 3 inch ribbed model.

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Now Sir, After all this, do you not think a few photos (or more then a few photos) would be in order???

 

[Ahelimech]

The more I am looking at this, it doesn't look like the barrel is cut at all. It looks like the choke device slips over the muzzle end and is soldered. When the wife gets moving around I will look for a tape measure. From my understanding, length is measured from a closed breech face, not necessarily the actual Barrel length. In this case it would technically extend past the threaded breech end slightly. Is this correct? It is beginning to look like a possible 'riot' model and not the 'trench' model. Maybe I got lucky and they wanted the extra length on the factory 20 3/4 Barrel and just added the choke.

 

[Ahelimech]

I guess the next question is if the device should or could be removed.

 

[DAS HUGH!]

Now Sir, After all this, do you not think a few photos (or more then a few photos) would be in order???

Indeed lol.. mine has plenty of patina also. So she ain't skeered to embark on a adventure of any sort. She ain't no safe queen. Super speed! Gotta love that name lol. So what this boils down to is basically what someone made by sawing this rascal off is a 3 inch capable riot size configuration. Oh and so far this seems to also feed shorties fine too with no need for adapters etc. Very cool guns.

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[DAS HUGH!]

But @J pace I feel like knows the most so far about these that I've seen here so far. I'm pretty sure he can tell you what you have. I think he collects them

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[indy1919a4]

Indeed lol.. mine has plenty of patina also. So she ain't skeered to embark on a adventure of any sort. She ain't no safe queen. Super speed! Gotta love that name lol. So what this boils down to is basically what someone made by sawing this rascal off is a 3 inch capable riot size configuration. Oh and so far this seems to also feed shorties fine too with no need for adapters etc. Very cool guns.

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Nice!!!!!!!!! what is the serial number range..??? No photo of the flaming bomb ?? You know in the gun photo world that is the sweetest plumb...

 

[J pace]

What I can tell from the photos and this is only my opinion. You have an early war production Riot gun not a trench gun. Used for guard Duty Base perimeter. Most Model 12 trench gun stock would be stamp GHD, sling swivel attachment and seed oil finish. The barrel would not have the notch for the barrel band as the trench gun had no Barrel band. The magazine tube would only have two holes at the capped end, no need for takedown pin. The bottom of the barrel forward of the magazine tube would have three screw slots in the bottom of it for attaching the bayonet lug/ heat shield..... the multi choke device in my opinion was installed after its military service.

 

[Duckyou]

I guess the next question is if the device should or could be removed.

Some of them were braised on - meaning some heat and they will come off.

I would get info from collectors on price differences to see if it is worth risking.

 

[Ahelimech]

What I can tell from the photos and this is only my opinion. You have an early war production Riot gun not a trench gun. Used for guard Duty Base perimeter. Most Model 12 trench gun stock would be stamp GHD, sling swivel attachment and seed oil finish. The barrel would not have the notch for the barrel band as the trench gun had no Barrel band. The magazine tube would only have two holes at the capped end, no need for takedown pin. The bottom of the barrel forward of the magazine tube would have three screw slots in the bottom of it for attaching the bayonet lug/ heat shield..... the multi choke device in my opinion was installed after its military service.

I believe it is the riot model also. It does have a hole that has been filled in on the buttstock where the sling mount would have been. Not sure what they used. I also believe the device was a post-war addition.

 

[J pace]

This is what the sling attachment would look like