GOA suing FL over Open Carry Ban & Under-21 Carry Ban.

[Miami_JBT]

 

[DustyDog]

Personally, a gun related legal event that would benefit me more would be the freedom to use a suppressor on any gun, anytime.

Good luck finding a concealed-carry holster for it

 

[Welldoya]

Of course cops open carry, I was talking about plain clothes detectives.
But a regular cop most likely would find himself in a situation where a 17 round Glock might be needed whereas a detective most likely would not. Same with the average citizen.

 

[Snake-Eyes]

Of course cops open carry, I was talking about plain clothes detectives.
But a regular cop most likely would find himself in a situation where a 17 round Glock might be needed whereas a detective most likely would not. Same with the average citizen.

Try not to fall for the “logic trap” the gun-control idiots setup.

The right to carry doesn’t rely on “how likely” you are to need it. It’s a RIGHT, and as the OP is pointing out, it’s currently being trampled on, especially in Florida.

If you are uncomfortable with strangers openly carrying, then adjust your behavior accordingly, but that’s not a valid basis to support denying other people’s RIGHTS.

Infringements are infringements. Whether written into unconstitutional “law” or whether enforced by unconstitutional LEO. All Citizens should find both situations repugnant.

 

[Miami_JBT]

Of course cops open carry, I was talking about plain clothes detectives.
But a regular cop most likely would find himself in a situation where a 17 round Glock might be needed whereas a detective most likely would not. Same with the average citizen.

I was a plainclothes detective for the last five years of my career. I wore civies and had a GLOCK 17 openly carried on my hip. No one paid mind to the gun nor the badge on my belt. In fact, most people didn't even realize that I was armed at all.

And your idea of a detective not needing 17rds is laughable. As a plainclothes detective, I was out in the sticks, with no back-up, going after armed suspects. I had more back-up and support as a uniform patrol cop back in my rookie days.

But in the end, this isn't about cops.

THIS IS ABOUT AN INALIENABLE RIGHT TO KEEP AND BEAR ARMS. A RIGHT THAT HAS BEEN ENUMERATED MULTIPLE TIMES VIA THE SUPREME COURT AS BEING A PERSONAL RIGHT OF THE PEOPLE.

Feelings have no say in the exercising and protection of rights.

 

[Miami_JBT]

Try not to fall for the “logic trap” the gun-control idiots setup.

The right to carry doesn’t rely on “how likely” you are to need it. It’s a RIGHT, and as the OP is pointing out, it’s currently being trampled on, especially in Florida.

If you are uncomfortable with strangers openly carrying, then adjust your behavior accordingly, but that’s not a valid basis to support denying other people’s RIGHTS.

Infringements are infringements. Whether written into unconstitutional “law” or whether enforced by unconstitutional LEO. All Citizens should find both situations repugnant.

Exactly

 

[DustyDog]

Of course cops open carry, I was talking about plain clothes detectives.
But a regular cop most likely would find himself in a situation where a 17 round Glock might be needed whereas a detective most likely would not. Same with the average citizen.

Yep... detectives carry openly as well... at least the smart ones do. But I'm not sure how you can invariably go out the door thinking: "Well, I'm not going to find myself in a situation where I'll need a 17-round Glock, so... "

We all walk around in the same world. "Civilians"... in raw numbers... are far more likely to find themselves in a situation where that Glock is needed than your average street cop... happens every day, in fact. And there is almost never a cop around when it goes down, not to mention a capably-armed civilian.

If you're ever trapped in the back corner of a grocery store by a nut with a rifle, or accosted by a street mob on your way to work, that .22 or even .380 pocket-pistol with iron sights won't be very reassuring (for one, I'm blind as a bat... I need an optic now! : ). In fact, the sight of an alert, open-carrying civilian can deter a potential perp from even proceeding with his plan just as easily as a cop can... just make sure they know you see them. I always smile at the shady ones... makes them think you just might be crazier than they are. Most criminals are looking for unarmed victims... which, curiously, concealed-carriers appear to be!

 

[Miami_JBT]

 

[Miami_JBT]

Florida Gun Rights Group Moving Forward with Lawsuit - Florida Daily

The Gun Owners of America (GOA) from Florida has filed a lawsuit looking to have a 1893 law overturned that bans citizens from openly carrying a firearm. GOA Florida Director Luis Valdez says the lawsuit is needed because the Republican lawmakers wont repeal it. Valdez says the 1893-gun...

floridadaily.com

The Gun Owners of America (GOA) from Florida has filed a lawsuit looking to have a 1893 law overturned that bans citizens from openly carrying a firearm.

GOA Florida Director Luis Valdez says the lawsuit is needed because the Republican lawmakers wont repeal it.

Valdez says the 1893-gun restriction law is unconstitutional. The law states, “it’s unlawful for any person to openly carry on or about his or her person any firearm or electric weapon or device.”

Florida is a pro-gun state. Gov. Ron DeSantis signed pro-gun legislation doing away with a state mandate that said residents 21 and up would need a permit to carry concealed firearms. The law is gone and so are the permits and the fees associated with it.

While Valdez acknowledges some things have moved forward with improving gun rights within the state, it’s not enough.

This year, the Florida GOA lobbied to repeal a 2018 bill that increased the age limit from 18 to 21 when purchasing a long rifle. Some Republicans supported the repeal, but the state GOP controlled Senate wouldn’t bring it up for discussion.

Those within the Governor DeSantis’ office have said he would get behind legislation to repeal the 1893-gun ban on open carry ban in that legislation, but state lawmakers haven’t brought it up.

Valdez has been critical of state GOP lawmakers. He accused Florida Republican Senate President Kathleen Passidomo of acting no different than state democrats on this issue.

Passidomo says she didn’t support open carry because law enforcement groups like the Florida Sheriffs Association wouldn’t back it.

“I think the timing on an open carry proposal may come up sooner rather than later,” said former Florida State Rep. Matt Caldwell. Caldwell was one of the few Republicans who voted against raising the age limit to purchase a rifle.

Caldwell says the state has moved in the right direction on addressing more pro second amendment legislations.

 

[Welldoya]

I knew when I posted my opinion that the usual suspects would have an opposing view and that’s fine. No problem here.
Yes, it’s possible that a civilian could need 17 rounds in a confrontation but I believe the average is 2 rounds fired at 7 yards.

 

[sloporsche]

If open carry passes fine , i would not oppose it nor would i open carry . I do like it only because i will not have to keep making sure mine is concealed anymore .

 

[Welldoya]

If open carry passes fine , i would not oppose it nor would i open carry . I do like it only because i will not have to keep making sure mine is concealed anymore .

I do think unintentional brandishing should not be a crime. I doubt that has been pursued many times anyway.

 

[Snake-Eyes]

I do think unintentional brandishing should not be a crime. I doubt that has been pursued many times anyway.

Concerning how often “unintentional brandishing” is pursued, you should really read the declaration to the court that the OP attached in post #1 of this thread. Specifically starting near the bottom of Page 8.


As for making it “not a crime”, again, that goes to the OP’s (and GOA’s) point: it’s ALL a crime. You just have an affirmative defense (defense against prosecution, not a defense against arrest) if you fall within the “exceptions”.

“You can beat the rap, but you can’t beat the ride.” Or something to that effect.


In a free state, if you see someone open carrying a pistol, is it in their hand and they seem to be pointing it at people? Take cover. Is it in its holster and they are minding their own business? Maybe do the same.

In a free state, if you see someone open carrying a rifle, are they carrying it at the ready in both hands, like they are on patrol, or is it sling over their shoulder while they hold grocery bags? Use your best judgment.

Again, if those scenarios are too much for you, then alter your behavior. The rest of us will continue to enjoy our freedoms and our lives and peacefully coexist.

I hate to break it to you, but in public, you are statistically ALWAYS around strangers with guns. Good guys AND bad guys.

 

[Welldoya]

Hey, you are right. I’ve seen the light. Good job.

 

[Miami_JBT]

I do think unintentional brandishing should not be a crime. I doubt that has been pursued many times anyway.

I was held at gun point by MDPD because I was riding my motorcycle and my shirt rode up while driving on the Palmetto expressway. Cop told me if I weren't a cop, he'd have arrested me for OC. Mind you, this is AFTER the "accidental exposure" bill was signed into law in 2011.

I literally had the situation that the bill was supposed to prevent, happen, and the only reason why I didn't spend an evening in DCJ was because I had a piece of tin in my wallet.

If I weren't PoPo and was John Q Public, I'd have been cuffed and stuffed into a MDPD green & white.

 

[Miami_JBT]

Like I said, no problem but I don’t need your condescending response.
You do you and I’ll do me.
It’s not the end of the world either way for me.
“Near the bottom of page 8”
Does anybody actually click on and read 8 pages posted by some random dude on the internet?
And I won’t be altering my behavior, whatever that means.

It isn't some random posting by some dude. It is my official declaration submitted to the court under penalty of perjury.

That's my declaration to the court.

The fact that you won't actually read the argument being presented in court says a lot.

 

[Welldoya]

Hey, you are right. I’ve seen the light. Good job.

 

[Miami_JBT]

Hey, you are right. I’ve seen the light. Good job.

Do you support people having the choice to open carry? Yes or no?

We aren't discussing the tacticool aspects or how mall-ninja one can be.

We're discussing the decriminalization of open carry and giving people the choice to conceal or carry openly.

Do you support people having that choice without fear of arrest?

Yes or no?

 

[DustyDog]

I do like it only because i will not have to keep making sure mine is concealed anymore .

BINGO.

Who wants to have to deal with gray areas? I was arrested once in my life (1989?), for "open carrying" (which I wasn't doing) even though I had a permit.

I had an attorney (who was an ex-SWAT guy that my brother-in-law, a S. Florida LEO, knew) who got the charges dismissed at arraignment (I didn't even have to appear). Lo and behold, the state appealed the dismissal, which is crazy, since nothing actually happened during the incident (long story). Then, the charges were dismissed a second time, and the record sealed and expunged... all over a gray area.

 

[DustyDog]

If open carry passes fine , i would not oppose it nor would i open carry .

And exactly...

We're not talking about mandating open carry... just giving people the choice, which you'd think the "pro-choice" types here would appreciate