Help me choose and mount a scope

[leostevo]

I recently acquired my first AR15. It has a 20" bull barrel, 1 in 12" twist. I am thinking of making it a semi-long-range gun; somewhere in the area of 100-600yds. I have always been more into pistols and have no reference for scopes or long range. I know it isn't much but I don't want to spend much more than $300 on the scope. I am mostly interested in honing longer range skills but I may also use the weapon to hunt with when my son gets a little bit older.

Here are some scopes I have been looking at:
http://www.basspro.com/Nikon-P223-AR-Riflescope/product/1202250501007/
http://www.basspro.com/Nikon-M223-AR-Riflescope/product/1110250501081/

I'm not hooked on the Nikons they just seem to be calibrated for the .223 round..... Does that even matter?

I'm not sure whether I should go with a 1x4 or 3x9. I just don't have any experience using scopes and don't know what to expect as far as sight picture at the ranges I want.

Am I asking a bit much to reach out to 600yds from a .223 AR15? What is the serviceable difference between a $75 mount and a $150 mount? Do I really need a reticle level? Any special considerations when it comes to actually mounting the scope? Should I use loctite or is it an improper fix for loose mounts?

I prefer to stay within www.basspro.com becuase I have several hundred dollars in points to spend there. Silly reason but it makes it easier with the wife.

I'm completely ignorant with these things, obviously.

-Steve

 

[Capt. Dave]

I have a M-223 used, but in perfect condition with 0MOA mount. PM me for good price.

 

[JohnAL]

I have the M-223 - 2x8x32 and I am quite happy with it for the money and for my use.

I am far from an expert but I'm not sure how much long range accuracy you are going to get with a 12" twist. Most want to use the heavier bullets for long range and the 12" twist may not stabilize the long heavy bullets.

 

[Daezee]

I have the M223 1-4x and 2-8x. 1-4x is too low of a power for your plans, but would be fine for deer hunting up to 200yd. You already have a heavier rifle, so I'd go with a Nikon 3-9x or higher power instead of a smaller scope. I do use a Nikon M223 2-8x on my deer hunting AR with its 16" bbl in 300 Blackout. I have a Burris 2-7x on my 16" .223 AR for hunting. On my "varmint" 18" .223 upper I have a 3-12x Primary Arms scope. I use AR mounts from $49 to $100 from a variety of makers with no problems (no loctite is used). I do like how the Nikon 1 piece AR mounts fasten to the scope and rifle though. I've never used a level; I just eyeball the scope reticle level.

 

[Army_of_One]

As mentioned before the 1:12 twist is slow and will have problems at longer ranges. I can't suggest a scope for you as I have only ever used an ACOG. My ACOG is calibrated for a specific barrel/ammo combination. The M-223 seems to be "Specifically designed for high performance AR rifles firing the .223 Rem NATO round with 55gr polymer tipped bullet at 3240 fps." The P-223 is "Specifically designed for high performance .223 AR rifles." I can suggest a mount, the Burris P.E.P.R. mount brings the scope forward of normal mounting rings, so that you can put your nose to the charging handle still.

 

[poff09]

If u haven't already go to Academy if ur in Pcola..they probably have the best scope section around here that u can actually look thru..the Nikon series r good scopes at a decent price but 600 yards might be pushing it..if u don't want to spend over $100 on a mount Nikon also had their own mount for the P series..it's 2 pieces instead of 1 like the PEPR but only $50


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[leostevo]

So, what is the reasonable distance limit for a 55gr fmj out of a 20" 1-12 bbl? 3-9x or 2-8x is starting to look like a viable option based on responses. Ofcourse, if I will never be able to put consistent rounds out to 500+yds then that higher magnification may be useless.


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[FrankT]

Yeah I think a cantilever mount like the PEPR is much better on an AR, buy the most scope you can afford. the Leupold VX-R series is excellent!

 

[Marquezj16]

As far as a scope goes - I like Nikon or Redfield or Leupold. I'd go with a 4-12x. For a mount - I like Nikon (1 piece - M223 or 2 piece - P223) or the Burris PEPR.

As far as your 1-12 twist barrel, it will limit you to probably 55 or lower grain projectiles - does not mean it would be less accurate - just would be affected more by distance or elements on the range. I've worked up a pretty good load for my 700 ADL Varmint using 55 gr Hornady V-max and 27.4 grs of BLC-2. I was consistently hitting a baseball at 340 yards and even hit a golf ball at the same distance about half the time. I wanted to push it out further but did not have the range to go further at the time. I suggest you shoot your rifle with a variety of ammo to determine your range and accuracy with whichever scope and mount you decide to go with. Only then will you know if its capable of being a 600 yd rifle. Good luck and safe shooting.

 

[Stanley13]

Here is the deal I can hardly see a deer at 200yards with 3-9zoom so I would say 600 not gonna happen with a non expert.

 

[leostevo]

I would never try to take a deer beyond 125yds with a 55gr .223 round; probably not even beyond 75yds. I am more interested in marksmanship at the 600yd mark. My intent is to buy something that will work at 600 yds but also be able to hunt with it at closer range.

Okay, here is a potentially laughable question: If I remove a sighted-in scope and remount it later at the same position on the rail, then will remain on target? I ask because I could, on the rare occasion that I hunt, switch it out with a red dot; but I don't want to spring for the quick detachable mount.

Remember when I mentioned my own ignorance about this?

 

[JohnAL]

I have a QD mount on the scope for my AR. It comes back within an inch at 100 yds. Plenty good for hunting. Just make sure that the slop in the Picatinny rail is taken out before you latch it down. Always slide it forward as far as it will go in the notches when latching or tightening.

 

[JohnAL]

Here is the deal I can hardly see a deer at 200yards with 3-9zoom so I would say 600 not gonna happen with a non expert.

I told you that you need to get away from those $40 scopes. eep:

 

[gtmcgeejr]

For something cheaper and reliable check out simmons predator quest scopes. They come in 4.5x18x44 or 6x24x50. Both are 30 mm main tube. Both are under $200.

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[Marquezj16]

By the way - Nikon ProStaff 4-12x40 with Nikoplex reticle can be had for $169. 4x is quick enough at 50-100 yards. 12X is plenty for shooting to longer range. Use the Nikon Spot On program to help you with dialing in your zero and distance.

 

[bigbulls]

The nikon spot on technology works and thats where i'd be looking. I was a sceptic about their spot on technology, thinking it was another BS gimmick, until i got invited to a nikon shoot in Texas showcasing their bdc reticles and spot on ballistic technology. We shot everything from standard ar rifles to subsonic and suppressed blackouts, to custom bolt .308's. I was able to hit 10" steel plates out to 500 yards with zero misses the first day and only a couple misses the second day. I know that doesnt sound all that impressive except i was firing rifles i had never touched before that day with scopes i didnt sight in.

I would look at a p223 in 4-12x40 with the bdc 600 reticle.

With a 1 in 12 barrel you are going to be limited to bullets that weigh 55 grains or less.
12 twist barrels are made to shoot light weight bullets at high velocities at varmints.

 

[leostevo]

Why the preference of the p223 over the m223?

 

[bigbulls]

Only your $300 limit. The M series is the better scope being built with the monarch lenses and coatings.

 

[Centermass556]

Vortex....you'll never regrret it, or look another scope..

 

[Capt. Dave]

Vortex....you'll never regrret it, or look another scope..

What he said, but getting out of his price range.