Could a concealed carrier have made a difference? Link

[Fletch]

http://bearingarms.com/bob-o/2016/06/13/concealed-carry-saved-lives-orlando/

This is also the best and most complete account and timeline of the shooting I have read. Did not realize the terrorist started shooting outside with an armed off duty cop working security and two other cops who failed to make hits before he got inside and started the slaughter. Many good points made about marksmanship by the experts. I'm sure most would say since a cop, the holy grail of gun skills in the majority of media and publics minds, failed that no civilian would have made a difference.

Great points made how a concealed carrier could have gained an advantage in a 360 degree environment while the shooter was targeting others on the dance floor or in the bathroom covering the door for example. Really obvious to anyone with common sense but that seems to be in short supply with all the analysis I've seen of the tragedy.

Where's this kind of analysis on the multi-network 24/7 coverage for a little balance and different perpective? Not even Fox has provided something this well reasoned. All we get is one person saying a good guy with a gun may have blah blah blah before the anchor cuts him off to go to break.

 

[3 men & a boat]

I often wonder the same thing in these situations. On one hand I'm probably not prepared for a gunfight, while he is, especially not with my little LCP and he has an AR.

To me the common sense response is to simply ask if a person were in that situation would they prefer to be armed or not?

Weather or not a CC would have made a difference or not is to me irrelevant. I, if put in that situation, know that I would always prefer to have a firearm to fight back with, even my little 380




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Viking1204]

I'm pretty sure most of us would have been able to get the jump on the guy while he was shooting others. Especially the guy in the bathroom, had he been armed he would most likely still be alive today.

 

[BamaFan]

Well since everyone is talking hypothetical if everyone stayed home instead of being out involved in drunken Homo slumber they'd all be alive as well.

 

[Fletch]

Just as easily could have been people in a packed club involved in a drunken Hetro slumber or families vacationing at Disney. None would be at fault or deserving of being gunned down by a POS hate filled Islamist just because they were outside of their homes.

Simple fact is, and I'm preaching to the choir here, that capable armed citizens with the mindset and skills to act is the only possible way to stop one of these turkey shoots before the bodies start piling up. No amount of laws passed in Washington can prevent this sort of thing but I'm getting the sense the right is starting to cave-in on the issue and just a matter of time before the so called "assault weapon" ban resurfaces.

I've never truly believed most of the republicans are vested in protecting gun rights anyhow. It's just been a reliable voting bloc for them to pander to for votes. Most are Washington elitist and would not have any problems passing laws restricting our rights. Hopefully Trump keeps waking up on the right side of the bed on the issue but who knows with him.

 

[wildrider666]

The element of surprise compounds the advantage of firepower. After the initial breach/engahement at the entrance, BG attacked the soft targets. As noted, inside a defensive shot or two may have detered the murders advance to certain areas. It was a good link.

 

[Glock31c]

Well since everyone is talking hypothetical if everyone stayed home instead of being out involved in drunken Homo slumber they'd all be alive as well.

I don't care what a person life style is. But you should not have to stay home because Isis don't like how you live or ain't perfect to them. Me or my family not going to stay home because cause of Isis or any lone wolf punk. Believe me I'm ready for a fight or going to due trying for my family or country.

 

[lonesouth]

I'm still shocked that out of 300+ people were not able to find 5 willing to confront the attacker. The BG can't shoot 5 people at one time, and all you need to do is disarm the BG, not necessarily gain control of the weapon, just remove his control. It is easy to monday morning QB this, but 300 v 1, 50 dead isn't good math. I blame the victim mindset established in "modern" society. The idea that the cops will come save me.

 

[kanaka]

Tell me what the law says about you carrying in a bar?

 

[oneshot]

You are not suppose to. just my 5 cents jj

 

[Viking1204]

I've noticed guys in bars before that were packing, hell, had a biker chick show me her nice pink pistol she had in the inside pocket of her leather biker jacket! The fact nobody shot back at this guy might have something to do with the cliental at this particular nightclub!

 

[Brandon_SPC]

I have been to a few clubs before and generally from the people I have met in a club setting I will guarantee they do not carry or associate with firearms and there are a few reasons to that. Remember a night club is a complete different animal in itself.


1.)In Florida if the business is primary devoted to serving alcohol you cannot legally carry (refer to FL Statute 790.06 (12))(bars, nightclubs) So right there you are already omitting your rights. Yeah if anyone was carrying a side arm they would possibly have stopped the POS.

2.) Generally when you are in a night club you get drunk, in a dark setting, dance around etc. I would always leave mine in the vehicle (I was always DD) becaue of such and never cared to drink but just to hangout with friends.

3.) Guys always testing other guys and the same with women

4.) The maturity setting

5.) You are in close proximity to people that can easy feeling your side arm etc. I have been groped by a few women in a night club before so the possibility of my sidearm being grabbed is high or the possibility of someone grabbing it by accident and getting scarred is also there. I mean there are a lot of reason why one won't carry in a setting like this.

So in the end yeah if one was carrying it could have stopped the man but in honesty how many people actually carry in a night club? I never did because of the above reason.

 

[fl57caveman]

I'm still shocked that out of 300+ people were not able to find 5 willing to confront the attacker. The BG can't shoot 5 people at one time, and all you need to do is disarm the BG, not necessarily gain control of the weapon, just remove his control. It is easy to monday morning QB this, but 300 v 1, 50 dead isn't good math. I blame the victim mindset established in "modern" society. The idea that the cops will come save me.

bunch of girlie men....I saw one crying that why didn't the bar search everyone before entering...like you can conceal a sig rifle..docile sheep,
fighting back physically is not in their makeup..

these people will be screaming for banning all guns...

but they would get a lawyer and fight you tooth & nail to use bathrooms other than the one they should be using

or bully a cake maker to bake them a cake for a queer wedding, when gay bakers are in abundance...

 

[Brandon_SPC]

Quick question has anyone thought that even though these people are "girly men" what is the natural instinct of people when something like this happens?.... Fight or Flight.... If one has never been accustomed to the mind set killing someone to protect someone, never in their life have had a chance to do such.... What is expected to happen... Flight or cower that is it.... Also lets add that the majority of night clubs have strobe lights, it is dark, hot, very disorented, probably the majority is drunk, on X, acid, the amount of smoke, debre flying everywhere over all the rounds, gun powder, conrete being busted, blood every where, people crying out in pain an agony.... Even if this guys weren't gay it is a bodies natural instinct to either fight or flight. How the firearms got in I have no idea. Or also the fact that how many women were probably there. Usually where there is one gay man there is always a woman or two.

We can always say it was 300 people vs one but we can also say this about previous wars, previous shootings etc... It is just the kind set of the people who are on the receiving end who can determine the outcome.

 

[kendive]

You are not suppose to. just my 5 cents jj

Unless you live in NC. They can carry in a bar as long as you are not drinking.

 

[Brandon_SPC]

Tell me what the law says about you carrying in a bar?

See FL Statute 790.06 (12)

 

[Seanpcola]

I think this is as good a place as any to bring this up.

I'm not a big drinker but I do have a few on the weekend about half the time. During the week it's beer after work, usually not more than two. On the weekend I enjoy a drink after dark, at home and no plans on leaving.

I always worry about the idea of someone breaking in, I've had a few mixed drinks but I'm in the position that I have no choice but to grab a gun to stop the threat. No matter how cut and dry the deal was, no matter how much it was the only option, no matter how clear the threat was I guess I'm screwed.

I'm very vigilant about my firearms being locked up. When I know I'm going to have a relaxed evening, no worries, the house is secured and I'm getting down to having a few in front of the TV everything goes in the safe including my CC. Also, I really never worry about someone breaking through the door at midnight. I don't let people I don't know come around, I don't have any enemies (well, I do have one now but I think he's under control and in another country) that will come gunning for me. I just see the chance of my place getting breeched as extremel slim. But, it does happen somewhere all the time.

Anyone have any experience with that or know any stories? How bad does a BAC nail you if you have an unexpected encounter? I mean, you've stayed home, minding your own business, not on the highway, not in a place where firearms are prohibited, did due diligence to avoid any contact with anyone but suddenly you go from a nightcap and heading for bed to life or death.

 

[Fletch]

I'm honestly surprised they haven't done more on a bigger scale but fear it's coming and this may be just the tip of the iceberg. Hope and pray I'm wrong though. I guess it's going to take losing a stadium or arena full of people for our sorry leaders to acknowledge Radical Islam has declared war on the west and there are literally millions of the cockroaches who support the cause.

 

[Brandon_SPC]

I think this is as good a place as any to bring this up.

I'm not a big drinker but I do have a few on the weekend about half the time. During the week it's beer after work, usually not more than two. On the weekend I enjoy a drink after dark, at home and no plans on leaving.

I always worry about the idea of someone breaking in, I've had a few mixed drinks but I'm in the position that I have no choice but to grab a gun to stop the threat. No matter how cut and dry the deal was, no matter how much it was the only option, no matter how clear the threat was I guess I'm screwed.

I'm very vigilant about my firearms being locked up. When I know I'm going to have a relaxed evening, no worries, the house is secured and I'm getting down to having a few in front of the TV everything goes in the safe including my CC. Also, I really never worry about someone breaking through the door at midnight. I don't let people I don't know come around, I don't have any enemies (well, I do have one now but I think he's under control and in another country) that will come gunning for me. I just see the chance of my place getting breeched as extremel slim. But, it does happen somewhere all the time.

Anyone have any experience with that or know any stories? How bad does a BAC nail you if you have an unexpected encounter? I mean, you've stayed home, minding your own business, not on the highway, not in a place where firearms are prohibited, did due diligence to avoid any contact with anyone but suddenly you go from a nightcap and heading for bed to life or death.

Personally me my life is more important wether I am sitting in front of the TV drinking a beer or two or walking around the house either my Glock is sitting next to me on the stand or my Shield is on me. We all know our tolerance to where we get sloppy drunk and whether we should hit that tolerance or not. Me having a couple drinks have never imparired my judgement to the point of where I do not know what is going on nor could shoot straight if something happened. I would rather fight it in court than to have my family see a few holes in me especially from my own home.

 

[fl57caveman]

I'm honestly surprised they haven't done more on a bigger scale but fear it's coming and this may be just the tip of the iceberg. Hope and pray I'm wrong though. I guess it's going to take losing a stadium or arena full of people for our sorry leaders to acknowledge Radical Islam has declared war on the west and there are literally millions of the cockroaches who support the cause.

you are right


does anyone have any idea how many muslim truck drivers there are? and how many have hazmat endorsement on dl?

thousands....isis has already said to attack the infidels with your ford F150....
anyone recall what happened with ammonium nitrate & diesel in ok cy?

massive damage....and these pos are busy infecting trking companies by the hundreds...