Emergency management performance-- food/ water distribution

[ccather]

I know I am being difficult and it is not my intention to cause conflict just to be contrary. Thank you for your latest post Telum Pisces and your patience.

You bring up excellent points and they make sense.

I just wonder how folks like the Salvation Army appear to overcome some of those problems? They were 24 hours ahead of others. Is it they just have a small amount of food to move and are really only helping a few folks and therefore the logistics are easier? Do they buy supplies when they arrive from local vendors instead of bringing it in? I thought the news report I linked said they moved their trucks in advance of the storm. If true, do they take a guess as to where they will be needed and sometimes they are wrong? I will ask my neighbor as he is the guy in the video.

Just trying to understand what I see and hear.

I really do not mean to prolong this thread.
-----------

How is the sheet rock removal coming along?

 

[Telum Pisces]

I know I am being difficult and it is not my intention to cause conflict just to be contrary. Thank you for your latest post Telum Pisces and your patience.

You bring up excellent points and they make sense.

I just wonder how folks like the Salvation Army appear to overcome some of those problems? They were 24 hours ahead of others.

Because they are local and store their stuff local! They have things donated from the local community. It's stored local. They take the chance that if a storm blows a roof off of their facilities that they will not be around to help. But most local organizations are mobile and agile. Agile and government are two words that don't go together.

 

[ccather]

Makes sense. Shame the government is not local. Then they could try the same. Oh, well...

 

[ccather]

Keyboards and mouses are wonderful things. One day I will learn how to use them. Sorry for this extra 'blank" post.

 

[MauserLarry]

For all the good that the Salvation Army does, people need to realize that the organization is religion, a denomination, an unholy division of the one and only Way, and most likely a denomination separate and apart from what you know as the Truth, with books and laws separate and apart and in addition to the Holy Bible. And every dollar anybody gives to them for whatever reason (and that includes them bell ringers at Christmas time) furthers their unholy agenda which is separate and apart from God's will.

I don't know about this, now. I ate some of their meals and don't remember a word being mentioned about religion. They fed everybody that came up, I never saw anybody turned away. They fed a lot of people too with nary a mention of money. If you have some information that proves they're bogus I'd like to see it, with facts my mind can be changed.

 

[MauserLarry]

It isn't that the response 'must take' at least 72 hours. It is more about how is it possible to shorten that time. I think that is generally what you are asking.

First, staged supplies - people, vehicles, relief aid - must be far enough away that they are safe and can drive in later. Further away is safer, but then it takes longer to get to the affected areas. Plus you need to call in people, gather supplies, and start to form a plan.

So, how do they drive in? The first 48 hours are information and dis-information overload. Local crews, say the Fire Dept, are clearing roads. For example, 9th ave is F*#$(*, then they round the corner and see that there are blocks where no trees have fallen, then they get further down the road and see more fallen trees. Update 1 is the road is impassible, update 2 is that things are better, update 3 is that it is a mess. Now imagine this info coming in from multiple agencies on thousands of miles of roads. It takes a while to sort this out. Crews have to safely be able to get here. People in need have to have a safe route to the pick up location. What roads are flooded? what is safe? Some roads are not flooded 24hrs later. Are those OK to drive on now? Etc.

Then you have to get the supplies to where they are needed. Power assessments and damage assessments come into play probably with a lot of other things. No need to set up a distribution site at X location, but what about location Y? You can 'plan' for a site to work beforehand but it may not work based on road damage, flooding, available power, or other conditions.

Can you imagine opening just 1 or 2 locations because they are safe, crews can get there and citizens can safely access the location? Everyone would stream to those 1 or 2 locations causing more problems - traffic congestion, traffic accidents, running out of supplies while people are still trying to drive there, etc. Best to have multiple locations that are spread apart to help people from different communities. Now refer back to the previous 2 paragraphs, information overload, changing conditions, etc.

These are just a small sample of things that go into making these decisions. And though I don't do this for a living, I've worked along side those that do. So my opinions are only based on the small parts of what I've seen. Hope that helps to understand why it is more complicated that it would initially appear.

This is a great post. Answers most all questions and is very clear. Why do you hate cheese?

 

[Molon Labe]

folks complaining, how about attend this conference and put money where your mouth is so you have an idea of how it actually works.

Northwest Florida Advanced Citizen Corps Academy

Find out how you can help your community with disaster preparedness!

www.eventbrite.com

I have NO sympathy for the SHEEPLE what-so-ever. "Soooo do I get ice and food and gas before the hurricane or AFTER the hurricane?" Dumb people waiting for the government to take care of them. Have some personal responsibility.

Somewhere I have an old poster of a pussle-gutted gruff Army supply sergeant standing in a pile of his wares. The caption is "Don't forget nothing!" Today was a good day, taking a break from the yard, to refill my gas cans, my bride re-stocked the larder. The generator runs most of the house. Hopefully my only concern, if danger comes our way, will be my neighbors trees falling on my house.....again.

 

[fl57caveman]

What We Believe | The Salvation Army USA

The Salvation Army is part of the universal Christian Church.Salvation Army places of worship are sometimes called

www.salvationarmyusa.org

the top "officer" gets less than $12,000 a year from what I know..

contrast that with united way or red cross..

 

[poppop]

I don't know about this, now. I ate some of their meals and don't remember a word being mentioned about religion. They fed everybody that came up, I never saw anybody turned away. They fed a lot of people too with nary a mention of money. If you have some information that proves they're bogus I'd like to see it, with facts my mind can be changed.

dont worry about it larry. ive been around and know margret st church of Christ since the 70’s. for all the good faithful people that attend there there are a few, well let me put it this way; a mule will have blinders on the side of its head but some jackasses have blinders in front of their eyes as well.
before anyone says anything im a member of the Church of Christ just not that one.

 

[Raven]

I don't know about this, now. I ate some of their meals and don't remember a word being mentioned about religion. They fed everybody that came up, I never saw anybody turned away. They fed a lot of people too with nary a mention of money. If you have some information that proves they're bogus I'd like to see it, with facts my mind can be changed.

Denomination invented in Whitechapel, England by a disgruntled Methodist, not God

 

[MauserLarry]

Denomination invented in Whitechapel, England by a disgruntled Methodist, not God

Hey Raven-thanks for posting that. It was a fascinating read. I'm going to drop any further comments by me on this because it is getting into personal beliefs and I try to respect every bodies. I'll just stick with my earlier post that my experiences personally have been positive.

 

[Raven]

Hey Raven-thanks for posting that. It was a fascinating read. I'm going to drop any further comments by me on this because it is getting into personal beliefs and I try to respect every bodies. I'll just stick with my earlier post that my experiences personally have been positive.

Me too

 

[M118LR]

Makes sense. Shame the government is not local. Then they could try the same. Oh, well...

About the 72 hour thing. Blame your Military. They are expected to survive the first 72 hours on thier own in order to allow the Big Government Machine to come to their aid.

Now your going to have to adjust some of your local thinking to take in the big picture of Nationalism. What makes you believe that the folks in the Snowbelt think it's imperative to pull your butt off the roof of your house when you chose to live in a Hurricane Prone Area?
Have you ever gone up North to shovel snow so that Old Folks & Children could survive an exceptionally harsh winter.

Here is another concept that seems foreign to you: In a Natural Disaster there are going to be casualties. If you and your's ain't able to survive the first 72 hours, the rest of the World calls that Natural Selection.

Don't mean to sound contrary, but it ain't the Government's job to mollycoddle those so arrogant that they can't prepare in thier local area for expected disasters. Next time the Government tells you to evacuate, leave or be capable of withstanding the Natural Disaster for at least 72 hours prior to whining about the National Response to your Local Disaster. JMHO.

 

[Big Shrek]

Question: Why did it take 72 hours for the government to set up food and water distribution? Can we do better? (These comments are not directed toward any first responders!)

Risk: This relatively mild storm exposes gaps (failures?) in emergency planning with regards to commodity distribution that could become life threatening in a larger disaster.

Evidence for concern:

Report from WEAR TV: https://weartv.com/news/local/chann...t-food-distribution-delay-for-escambia-county:

Channel 3 asked Emergency Management Director Eric Gilmore why the supplies aren't here yet. He says the food and water were ordered from Tallahassee even as the storm was raging.

But Sally moved east with fierce winds and rain, and the trucks couldn't get out of the state capitol. Parts of I-10 were impassable due to rivers running over the road.

Gilmore explained further, "Those commodities and everything will not roll to our area until it dies down. So yesterday [Thursday] morning was actually day one for recovery -- for us to try to get these assets in."

Thursday, there were more delays from flooding on 1-10 in Sally's aftermath.

"National Guard's ready to go, I had the manpower, I just didn't have commodity," Gilmore continued.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

After reading this, you probably spotted, let us be generous here, a "lack of imagination" in the emergency response plan.

Areas of concern:

• He says the food and water were ordered from Tallahassee even as the storm was raging. Ya think you could have picked up the phone a few hours earlier? Don't even need fast reflexes to recognize a threat as the storm was only moving 2-3 mph. Even if storm changed direction, it was only a three hour return trip back to Tally for the trucks.
• ..trucks couldn't get out of the state capitol. Why are the commodities hoarded in the state capital? That location sure did not work out well this time because:
• Those commodities and everything will not roll to our area until it dies down. Imagine if we had some of them stored nearby? They would not need to "roll in". The trucks could not get here because:
• Thursday, there were more delays from flooding on 1-10 in Sally's aftermath. Flooded roads and closed bridges after a hurricane. Man, I did not see that one coming. Who would have thought?...

I am not an expert in such matters and I am sure there are a bunch of great excuses that explain the above but,
will those excuses feed your family if and when food/water distribution really, really matters?

We can do better.

THE FIRST 72 ARE ON YOU!
That's repeated often everywhere.

Frankly, if anyone failed to have sufficient stock on hand to cover for 72 hours,
during Hurricane Season, on the Gulf Coast, they may need to turn in their Man Card.
Those with a family, should be fully prepared for at least a MONTH a this point,
just due to the Liberal Moron Unrest going on right now.

But, to answer your questions...
1. Everyone underestimated Sally. Totally. And we all believed the Weather Channel.
I even fell for their BS and didn't check the Isobar charts...my error.
Forgot the lessons from Hurricane Elena...we got hit literally twice by that bleeper.
https://noaahrd.files.wordpress.com/2015/09/elena1985filledrainblk.gif?w=640
NEVER totally trust the Spaghetti Models...they're only working with the data
that has been programmed into them. If it's in the Gulf, watch yer butt.
This should remind everyone that a Tropical Storm can suddenly pick up
massive power, become a Cat 3 overnight, & rain destruction upon us all.

2. Trucks arriving. They weren't going to get all the way here...
due to I-10 & Hwy 90 & Hwy 98 bridges being flooded.
Cutting through groves of downed pine & oak trees takes time.
Not to mention the power lines downed all over the place that will entangle.
Zero east-west corridors for a couple days. Same as Katrina/New Orleans.
We were stopped shortly after arriving in Mississippi by epic amounts of damage,
NOBODY was going to come into there from the East. Underscored by Michael.
It was over a WEEK before we could get through to deliver to Panama City...


3. Storing food/etc nearby.
Well...here's the thing...can't do that with bottled water...as it expires after
a year...so what they do is get a bottling company to deliver FRESH/NEW
bottled water by the truckload once it's determined there is a need.
MRE's have a different system, as it's Military Chow, so they get flown in
by AirOps, who has to wait until the skies are clear enough to fly to the rally point,
then they are delivered by semi trucks to the affected area.
Tarps are about the only thing that can be stored, and they have a shelf life too.
Get brittle as heck after awhile.
Then there's the whole storage thing...wanna build a building that can withstand
a Cat 5 hurricane AND solve the flooding issue?? Hrm...yeah...that's more money
than anyone is gonna spend.

And finally...
IT AIN'T THE GOVERNEMENT'S JOB TO PROTECT ANYONE FROM THEIR
OWN FOOLISHNESS AND FAILURE TO PREPARE WHEN THEY LIVE IN
HURRICANE CENTRAL!
Or...they'd mandate all homes being built should be built from concrete & steel rebar,
with a total ban on all homes not on pylons in flood zones
and a total ban on woodframe homes alltogether.
They would also require each home to have a Generator in hurricane areas...



But don't feel too bad, because only 1 in 100 store owners who sell fresh foods
have a generator...and most of those are only strong enough to run minimal
lighting and the fuel pumps, NOT their refrigeration units, and they all lost
thousands of dollars of milk/cheese/cold foods. But they're not THAT worried
about it, as they'll recoup it all from FEMA & Insurance. Even Walmart screwed
that up, as evidenced by their lack of fresh food because all their freezers lost power.


So what did we all learn from this??
First, build the right kind of home for Hurricane survival...

if you already have your own home, be ABOVE the 100-yr flood mark,
and have a GENERAC or other generator installed before the next one hits.
That will solve your food issues...and allow you to run proper water filters.

If you are in an apartment/in the flood zone/wooden roof, you are SCREWED.
Maybe not this year but eventually all wood/tar paper shingle roofs fail.
Move ASAP or REBUILD. Dave Ramsey can help this.
Oak trees are nice for shade, but 100% deadly/dangerous in hurricanes.
Drive down Jackson Street in Pensacola if you doubt this in the least.
Just one 8" around limb can puncture & peel a quarter or more of a roof.
For an easy to see graphic example of what a tree can do, observe the home
just across the Hwy 90 bridge in Milton as you go thru the curve....
giant hole from front to back of the house where a tree fell through it.

Seek out Prepper sites and follow their directions.
EVERYONE should have at least a month's worth of food on hand just for
general purposes. If you don't have enough canned goods in your pantry
to cover your family for a month, you failed. Spam is your friend.

OMGAWSH, I CAN'T COOK ANYTHING!!!
Sure ya can...just think a little...5 minutes with tin snips in a pinch
And frankly, anyone without a good grill in Florida needs to be horsewhipped.

Exercise a little Personal Responsibility and seriously plan for storms.
Heck, if you are prepared for Zombies, pretty much everything else is a piece of cake!!

 

[General Snafu]

Question: Why did it take 72 hours for the government to set up food and water distribution? Can we do better? (These comments are not directed toward any first responders!)

Risk: This relatively mild storm exposes gaps (failures?) in emergency planning with regards to commodity distribution that could become life threatening in a larger disaster.

Evidence for concern:

Report from WEAR TV: https://weartv.com/news/local/chann...t-food-distribution-delay-for-escambia-county:

Channel 3 asked Emergency Management Director Eric Gilmore why the supplies aren't here yet. He says the food and water were ordered from Tallahassee even as the storm was raging.

But Sally moved east with fierce winds and rain, and the trucks couldn't get out of the state capitol. Parts of I-10 were impassable due to rivers running over the road.

Gilmore explained further, "Those commodities and everything will not roll to our area until it dies down. So yesterday [Thursday] morning was actually day one for recovery -- for us to try to get these assets in."

Thursday, there were more delays from flooding on 1-10 in Sally's aftermath.

"National Guard's ready to go, I had the manpower, I just didn't have commodity," Gilmore continued.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

After reading this, you probably spotted, let us be generous here, a "lack of imagination" in the emergency response plan.

Areas of concern:

• He says the food and water were ordered from Tallahassee even as the storm was raging. Ya think you could have picked up the phone a few hours earlier? Don't even need fast reflexes to recognize a threat as the storm was only moving 2-3 mph. Even if storm changed direction, it was only a three hour return trip back to Tally for the trucks.
• ..trucks couldn't get out of the state capitol. Why are the commodities hoarded in the state capital? That location sure did not work out well this time because:
• Those commodities and everything will not roll to our area until it dies down. Imagine if we had some of them stored nearby? They would not need to "roll in". The trucks could not get here because:
• Thursday, there were more delays from flooding on 1-10 in Sally's aftermath. Flooded roads and closed bridges after a hurricane. Man, I did not see that one coming. Who would have thought?...

I am not an expert in such matters and I am sure there are a bunch of great excuses that explain the above but,
will those excuses feed your family if and when food/water distribution really, really matters?

We can do better.

I don't know about you guys. Maybe it's because we get more storms down in the Southern part of Florida. Most of us are smart enough to keep our pantries full and plenty of water on hand, long before a storm hits. At the last minute you also plug the drain in your tub and fill it with water.

If you happen to have a domestic water supply like most of my neighbors and I do, you put a pitcher pump on top of your well so you can get water to flush your toilet without needing electric. Last but not least, fill your gas tank before the power goes out at the local gas station. We always get a good laugh out of one particular group of locals who are crying they have no supplies when they could have bought supplies instead of Mad Dog 20/20 and meth. We certainly have some dumb kneegrows in our neck of the woods. Dey always B sayin', "We din no, de lectric mite be goin' out on us."

 

[Big Shrek]

While we are talking about MRE's....
where's the gum you're supposed to chew so you could poop later??
90's MREs had a chemical that'd lock up yer rear exhaust in the field,
and you literally wouldn't be able to drop any bombs for days...

took two days& a dose of waffle house eggs to go after the chicken creole I had friday...
those three little mints did NOTHING....

 

[M118LR]

Not to be confused with C-RATS, D-RATS,K-RATS, the MRE's of the 90's had chocolate bars made from paraffin wax right here in St. Augustine Fl.

 

[ccc]

Why is it common place to expect the government to feed you and your family these days ? Last I read America is not a socialist country

 

[SAWMAN]

Your kiddin' right - - -> why is it common place. Ever hear of food stamps,etc. I coulĺd list 20+ different WELFARE programs. The government doles out money to the people that simply do not want to work.
You do believe that don't you ?? ---- SAWMAN

 

[ccc]

Your kiddin' right - - -> why is it common place. Ever hear of food stamps,etc. I coulĺd list 20+ different WELFARE programs. The government doles out money to the people that simply do not want to work.
You do believe that don't you ?? ---- SAWMAN

I am agreeing with you and saying why is it that people on here even come up with a thread like this ? Take fiscal responsibility and prepare for any situation to take care of your family and not need “Gubment” to feed and water you !!!!!