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Thoughts on the Net Neutrality

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  • polebarn

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    It seems like someone who doesn't understand the internet typed this up. We've been living in the "wild west" of internet with basically no problems. If service providers even tried what you're saying, everything would crash over night.

    Then, try to enforce it. Example, I have satellite internet and for some reason, certain websites don't load, so I use TOR and bypass whatever garbage they installed to stop access.

    Realistically, Netflix and YouTube will need to pony up cash because those two services account for a massive amount of all traffic. Forums? A drop in the bucket data wise.

    Data and bandwidth are getting cheaper by the day, not more expensive. This nickel and dime stuff would just mean customers go somewhere else. Mobile data is also going unlimited with better and better speeds.

    So as it stands, there will be at least 3 options. Cable, satellite, mobile via LTE networks. Fiber is also spreading rapidly.

    I'm not against all regulation, but a lot of the fear here seems to be blown way out of proportion.

    Rural will get even worse though.There might be competition in big cities,but us hicks will continue to pay through the nose for sub-standard speeds.
     

    Droshki

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    Rural will get even worse though.There might be competition in big cities,but us hicks will continue to pay through the nose for sub-standard speeds.

    Somebody that gets it.

    I'm in a master planned community, with a huge HOA, that has huge bargaining power. I pay about 1/3 what my coworkers pay for internet service, and my rate is fixed. I have fiber right to my garage, and battery backup on the fiber to copper media converter outside my house, and whole house internet, with multiple routers and switches. Im not going to be the first one hurt by this. Its gonna be all the single customers, that live in places with zero competition. Again Niceville is a perfect example- one company for internet and cable. Zero competition. Now, zero regulation.

    I mean is anyone seriously gonna argue that cable companies arent the most hated entities in the universe? Now we're simply moving ISPs into the same category.
     

    Droshki

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    It will also be extremely simple for them to reject encrypted traffic like Tor and VPNs. If they cant read the packets? They'll simply not pass it if they dont want to. Thats how they can enforce it.
     

    Droshki

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    I mean is anyone seriously gonna argue that cable companies arent the most hated entities in the universe? Now we're simply moving ISPs into the same category.

    Because that is exactly what happened in this evolution. Cable companies abused their customers for decades, to the point that everyone started "cutting the cord". Sure some traffic moved to OTA, but thats a PITA to DVR and content is very limited, so unless you like watching junk shows on major networks, on "Appointment TV Schedule", you went a different route. I've had satellite. Both DirecTV and Dish are universally despised. DirecTV has been shedding customers like crazy for years. They sure could never keep MY bill straight. Ungodly bad customer service.

    Therefore, almost all this former cable traffic ended up on the internet. Because cable companies sucked so bad, and there were so few other options.

    When the ISPs realized this, they said: "Hey, take off the chains, all that stifling regulation--let us operate just like the cable companies!!" And now they will.
     

    donr101395

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    Here’s how its gonna go:

    Basic Internet: $19.95/mo.

    This will be blanket marketed. Every commercial break. You’ll never see the fine print that only an owl could read, at the bottom of the television screen, for longer than 500 milliseconds.

    Realistic speed internet, that loads more than one page/hr: $59.95/mo. 36 mo contract required. Early termination fee of $40.00/mo

    News sites: Additional $6.95/mo. 12 month subscription required.

    Music sites: (Spotify, etc) $5.95/mo each, or get the music upgrade package for $18.95/mo. 12 month subscription required.

    Forum sites: $4.95 per forum, or get the forum upgrade package for $18.95/mo. 12 month subscription required.

    Streaming video package: $29.95/mo: Includes Hulu, Zulu, and Mulu, but not Netflix . 12 month subscription required.

    Netflix can only be viewwed if you subscribe the Extreme Entertainment Package. Includes above video sites, and Netflix. $49.95/mo. 36 month subscription required.

    And so on, on content fees. Any website your ISP doesn't approve of, or is simply unable to pay your ISP to be fast tracked, will go one the 1/MB per hour track. Will take days to load a page, but legally, they can say they are providing it to you. After all, it is part of the basic package.

    Thats the billing structure.



    Then you get to the data caps, and data overage fees, add extra fees for each computer, and mobile device fee, router traffic fees, switch traffic fees, Ethernet cable maintenance fees,and fees for…. Well I’m sure you’re getting the picture.

    And on top of it all, you’ll have the really great feeling when you get your 14 page bill every month (that only a PhD candidate can understand), of knowing that you did this all to yourself!!!


    Because it was like that two years ago before it was enacted. GFR :noidea:
     

    Ross7

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    It wasn't up to the FCC to impose net neutrality in the first place, its job is to enforce the law. If Congress wants net neutrality, Congress can pass a law and then the FCC can enforce it.
     

    Droshki

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    It wasn't up to the FCC to impose net neutrality in the first place, its job is to enforce the law. If Congress wants net neutrality, Congress can pass a law and then the FCC can enforce it.

    What's the last meaningful law congress has passed? Obamacare? They haven't even passed a budget in years, only continuing resolutions. And this year, even though they control both houses of congress they are over two months late on this year's budget, and could only pass a 2 week CR last week, that runs out right before Christmas. These are the guys you want to handle this?

    Congress is in the pocket of wealthy individuals and corporations. HUGE campaign contributions so they can do their bidding, so they can get MORE huge campaign contributions to get re-elected. But you trust them to look out for you? Not unless you've made a $500,000 contribution lately, lol...
     

    Droshki

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    Because it was like that two years ago before it was enacted. GFR :noidea:

    So what is repealing it supposed to accomplish? I've not heard a good reason. Is it because the excessive regulations were stifling innovations? Which innovations?
     

    donr101395

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    So what is repealing it supposed to accomplish? I've not heard a good reason. Is it because the excessive regulations were stifling innovations? Which innovations?


    The better questions are why was it originally passed? What innovations did it create? What injustice did it correct? Why do rural areas around here still not have better ISP options after two years of regulation and oversight? It corrected nothing, there was not issue that is correctable by the government.
     

    Droshki

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    The better questions are why was it originally passed? What innovations did it create? What injustice did it correct? Why do rural areas around here still not have better ISP options after two years of regulation and oversight? It corrected nothing, there was not issue that is correctable by the government.

    https://www.inverse.com/article/38761-fcc-net-neutrality-cyber-monday-twitter

    https://www.fightforthefuture.org/news/2017-12-05-open-letter-from-artists-we-support-net/

    http://www.bbc.com/news/technology-42096185

    and on and on...

    And, in an open letter to the FCC, a group, made up of 1,000 small businesses from around the US, wrote: "The success of America's start-up ecosystem depends on more than improved broadband speeds.
    "We also depend on an open internet - including enforceable net neutrality rules that ensure big cable companies can't discriminate against people like us.
    "We're deeply concerned with your intention to undo the existing legal framework.
    "Without net neutrality, the incumbents who provide access to the internet would be able to pick winners or losers in the market.
     

    Droshki

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    The better questions are why was it originally passed? What innovations did it create? What injustice did it correct? Why do rural areas around here still not have better ISP options after two years of regulation and oversight? It corrected nothing, there was not issue that is correctable by the government.

    It was passed to protect consumers:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Net_neutrality_in_the_United_States

    BTW great reading in this article. Check the 261 references for letters by hundreds of people explaining why it should not have been repealed. The information on this subject is almost limitless.


    Now, you might answer my question, in turn?
     

    donr101395

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    It was passed to protect consumers:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Net_neutrality_in_the_United_States

    BTW great reading in this article. Check the 261 references for letters by hundreds of people explaining why it should not have been repealed. The information on this subject is almost limitless.


    Now, its your turn to answer my question.


    Protect them from what? None of the stuff it was protecting people from was happening so it did nothing except cost money.

    Seriously, wikipedia hahahahahaha
     

    Droshki

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    Protect them from what? None of the stuff it was protecting people from was happening so it did nothing except cost money.

    Seriously, wikipedia hahahahahaha

    You read all 261 references already? and still didn't answer my original question??

    So what is repealing it supposed to accomplish? I've not heard a good reason. Is it because the excessive regulations were stifling innovations? Which innovations?
     
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    Droshki

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    Protect them from what? None of the stuff it was protecting people from was happening so it did nothing except cost money.

    Seriously, wikipedia hahahahahaha

    Who did it cost money? Do you have a reference for this information? How much money? From who? When did it start? Did it end yet?
     

    Jeb21

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    Net neutrality was a good thing. It promote competition. It gives power to consumer and keeps the greedy defacto monopolies from stealing too much of our money in monthly fees. All of that is gone now.

    Obama had to put net neutrality in a regulation because the legislature refused to pass any laws on the topic simply because they did not want to be seen as conspiring with the liberal communist Muslim, democrat, who-was-not-even-born-in-our-country.

    At some point, those in Washington need to put country first, and party second.
     

    Jeb21

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    This is a great simple summation of the problem that I copied from on of the links Droshki posted

    Net neutrality is about nothing more than keeping Comcast, Verizon and the rest of them from extorting money from consumers and content providers just because they control the Internet off-ramps.
     

    Droshki

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    Good summation, thanks.

    However, it appears that some of our fellow members simply don't believe in closing the barn doors until after the cows have already gone.

    Its one way to go through life, I suppose
     

    donr101395

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    You read all 261 references already? and still didn't answer my original question??
    You didn't answer mine. Your stance seems to be the equivalent of we need a law to protect us from an imaginary boogie man. It sounds a lot like the claims of there will be blood in the streets about CCW laws.
    When did we start preemptive punishment for things that haven't happened.
    Should we start locking up women because they are equipped to be prostitutes and.men for being rape ready?

    Sent from my Moto G (5) Plus using Tapatalk
     
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