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IWI TAVOR ??'s

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  • 45longslide

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    Hey Sawman if you check out bullpupforum they have a lot of good information there. Gear Head Works makes what they call a razorback. Brings the rail up to AR level. this would simplify optic-mount choices, but would increase hold over distance. I use a pepper mount with a 1-4 vortex pst. Very happy with this configuration. If it were a little higher it would be more comfortable but mine was quite a bit cheaper and works fine. If you get the primary arms extra high AR mount it works perfectly I have been told. As far as triggers go, there is a guy on bullpupforum that has developed a new trigger for the tavor, sold under the name shootingsight. There have been good reviews of his. I personally am waiting for the Geissele trigger that should be out by the end of the year. Also there are a couple of companies that are making different hand guards for it that hold lights ext. I am no expert but read a lot....LOL. You are also welcome to try my setup as well. Just PM me if you are interested.
    Dave
     

    SAWMAN

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    Thanks for the offer Dave. I was also concerned about the trigger. As I have told others,I understand what the gun was developed to do(it's usage)and I am stepping out of that "box". HOWEVER ....... I was just wondering what the guns potential for accuracy at 200yds MAX,with a good trigger and a well designed scope/sight/thermal mounting system. Granted,a Geissele would be tits.

    Understanding that some of the AUG's are pretty accurate,but had some reservations about a switch bbl gun also. ---- SAWMAN
     

    Little Jack

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    Bill,

    The tavor barrel is pretty solid. if I had to guess I would say it's much more robust than the steyr based solely on the ease of removal. the biggest hindrance with the Tavor is the really heavy trigger. it will still do minute of man no problem at 200 yards.
     

    Daezee

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    There is a video showing how to easily remove 1 of the trigger springs, lightening the trigger pull by 4-5 pounds. So easy that even I could do it, and I didn't stay in a Holiday Inn.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dizuRNL0HIs

    FWIW, tests I've done on my MSAR STG556 showed no zero change when pulling out and reinstalling it's bbl.
     

    Dan1612

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    There is a video showing how to easily remove 1 of the trigger springs, lightening the trigger pull by 4-5 pounds. So easy that even I could do it, and I didn't stay in a Holiday Inn.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dizuRNL0HIs

    FWIW, tests I've done on my MSAR STG556 showed no zero change when pulling out and reinstalling it's bbl.

    Looks pretty simple. Let me see what I can do. I'll report back shortly.
     

    Dan1612

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    Yup. I can live with that. Very similar to a standard AR trigger in weight, but the grit feels much more plastic, less metallic. Like there's plastic grinding together instead of metal, and a much more predictable break. Not bad, not bad at all.

    There is no reason why the trigger pull, with the spring removed, should affect accuracy much, whereas before, pulling with enough strength to release the sear was a feat in and of itself for more than a few times.

    Needless to say, since I'm not going to the desert, ever again, the spring is staying out. Hope that helps.
     
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    45longslide

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    I have yet to test long range accuracy. My eyes are not what they use to be. It comes in 16.5 and 18 inch variety. 1 in 7 twist hammer forged barrel. So I would assume larger bullet weights would prove more accurate. I am going to order some Hornady 5.56, 75gr Superformance BTHP Match ammo and see what it will do. Just don't have a lot of free time. I have 5 school age kids and work full time... But I drive through Cantoment daily if you want to do some testing on your own. I really don't mind.
    Dave
     

    SAWMAN

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    Thanks for the SUPER kind offers guys. "Try before you buy" would definitely be my preferred method on a weapon of this "difference" and cost.

    I do believe that the 18" would be my choice. Color ...... any color will do as long as it is black. Uhhhhhh ...... does it come in ODG or just FDE ?? Anyway ..... I absolutely love the 1:7 twist. This alone was a draw for me.

    The "extra" spring would have to go. (THANK YOU DAEZEE for the link. Almost too damned easy.) I also believe that I could finish it up with the same thing(dry graphite) that I have done to my NEF/Handi's. My 300BLK Handi is <3lbs.

    Maybe we can schedule a day at our range in Molino and give it a try. I have plenty of QUALITY 223/5.56 ammo. Some quality scopes and rings in my safe also that we could test the accuracy of the weapon. --- SAWMAN
     

    45longslide

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    They just started offering OD green also...I believe I read they started a Police-Military sales division. Where you could order directly from them at a substantial discount....not just department sales, but to individual sales as well.
     

    Little Jack

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    They just started offering OD green also...I believe I read they started a Police-Military sales division. Where you could order directly from them at a substantial discount....not just department sales, but to individual sales as well.

    A posting on the bullpup forum says it's $1596 shipped for LE sales. That's not much better than they're going for on GB right now.
     

    Daezee

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    45longslide brought over his 16" Tavor this morning for me to examine. THANK YOU VERY MUCH!

    He had done the "remove a spring from trigger group" modification. There was quite a bit of light weight take-up before the heavier trigger pull part started (easily managed and gave similar results as a 2 stage trigger pull which I like). I don't have a trigger pull gage, but it felt like around 7-8 pounds. It felt a little lighter than the pull on my MSAR STG556 bull pup.

    Using "conventional" height AR scope mounts (Burris PEPR, Nikon M223, Primary Arms, etc), both of us felt that if the mount was a bit higher it would work better for fast eye/scope alignment...makes sense, as the stock on an AR is about a half inch below the AR top rail, and you are using scope mounts designed for the AR. It appeared to be no big problem, as you just alter your cheek weld a touch. Using my thermal as a standalone sight, you may have to alter your cheek weld a touch because the mount holds the thermal in about the same position as an AR mount holds a scope.

    The safety made no more noise than an AR safety when snapped on and off and was easily manipulated for less noise with 1 finger than an AR safety is.

    Rail space: My night time application would be day optic with my thermal in front. Plenty of room if the day optic is a red dot. Plenty of room if using a Leupold 1.25-4x (9.5"). Barely enough room if using a 11.75" long scope, and I do mean BARELY...would have to have the scope as far back as you can and still have a full field of view in order to have enough room. 45longslide said Midwest Industries may be making an extension that adds to the length of the top rail, but I could not find anything that added to the top rail length. An ACOG, length-wise, should be awesome, but may have too much fixed magnification for my use with thermal. I may need to revisit putting thermal in front of an ACOG. Manticore Arms once asked if anyone was interested in a longer top rail for the Tavor, but I don't see where they are actually making a longer rail. I just sent a msg to Manticore about a longer rail.

    Short hunting capacity mags work fine and stick out far enough for easy use.

    Not that .223/5.56mm recoil is heavy, but the recoil felt softer than an AR (I fired it 3 shots).

    I monitor my bbls for wear...no way to put my .223 throat erosion gage into the Tavor without removing the bbl.

    Oal was shorter than some of my SBR configurations, yet it contained a 16" bbl.

    If I had a Tavor, it would get shot some with a suppressor, so there will be more filth inside the stock housing to clean out, so buy a pack of the Q-tips with the long wood sticks. I would also invest in one of the various pieces that fully seal off the opening opposite the ejection port to reduce the soot on the shooter's face when shooting suppressed. I know you can take the bolt/carrier/gas piston assembly apart for cleaning. It looks like you could clean the assembly without taking it fully apart every time.

    45longslide sampled a bite of my just cooked this morning wild pig sausage and liked it.
     
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    45longslide

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    Np anytime. You are right. I didn't look at the MI handguard closely. Just a handguard extension not a top rail extension. My bad.
     

    Little Jack

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    The attachment method for the rail seems like it would be easy to make a longer one. Get rid of the BUIS while you're at it.
     

    Daezee

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    I just got this msg in from Manitcore Arms in reply to my request regarding a longer top rail with more room for optics:

    Bruce,

    We are starting to machine top rails this week. the design was done for a while, we simply needed machine time to actually make them!

    Sincerely,

    Sven Jonsson
    Manticore Arms

    902 S. Randall Rd.
    Suite #C318
    St. Charles, IL 60174
    630-715-0334
    svenj@manticorearms.com


    -------- Original Message --------
    Subject: Contact Us Requested
    From: brucelarson@bellsouth.net
    Date: Tue, July 22, 2014 1:23 pm
    To: info@manticorearms.com

    You have received a contact request from a visitor to your storefront at http://www.manticorearms.com:

    E-mail Address: brucelarson@bellsouth.net
    Name: Bruce
    Company: n/a
    Phone Number:
    Request:

    I see where some folks asked about a longer top rail for the Tavor...did anything ever come from that? I just examined a Tavor, but haven't bought yet. I do night hog hunting from an electric buggy with a clip-on thermal in front of my day optic and the Tavor with its shorter oal would be a great help. If only the Tavor top rail was just a half inch to an inch further towards the muzzle, I'd have room for my day optic and thermal clip-on without having to find a shorter variable power optic. I have no need for backup iron sights. Thanks, Bruce in Florida
     

    SAWMAN

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    Thanks to both of youz guyz for the in depth examination of the TAVOR. I appreciate your time spent. Wish I could have been there.

    This weapon is a distinct possibility for my thermal,night hunting needs. My Bad Boy Buggy is fairly narrow(the bench seat) which makes it pretty hard to get weapons into position to shoot from the seat. If the occupants pile out then you do not have a good enough rest to shoot from even with a bipod. AND ..... the associated noise made by trying to get yourself and weapon into position is really detrimental to taking the shot in a timely manner.

    For our application a weapon that is short,IMO <30 inches OAL,and fairly light,NO 9lb+ guns allowed, will be an added "bonus" to taking a fairly quick,and more important,SAFE shot.

    A bullpup style weapon would be a real plus. I am also thinking about a (and I really hate to say it considering I have been poo-poo'ing them) ...... AR/"pistol". I would opt for the 10+ inch bbl. A 12 would be mo-bedda. Chambering ..... ? .....out of a short bbl,they all suck. :whistle: --- SAWMAN
     

    Little Jack

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    You may need to examine the tavor more concerned with weight. It's kind of a pig. It's less noticeable than an AR because the weight is so close to you but it is significantly heavier than a comparably equipped AR.
     

    Daezee

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    I know from whence Sawman is coming. While I typically have a SBR, but the suppressor adds some length right back on, for him to drive, he lays his rifle across his lap with the muzzle end sticking out his side of his buggy (I believe he's made contact with some of the tree branches with the muzzle end also). To raise it up and aim out the front, he has to move the butt end over to me to get his muzzle inside the frame of the buggy and then swing it towards the front. Basically 2 movements. With a shorter firearm, he'd only have 1 movement to get ready. On our last yote, Sawman was in the act of moving his rifle into position as I had spotted the yotes and wanted Sawman to shoot...the yote was in the act of leaving (it's mate had already left, having heard Sawman getting ready), so I shot, as Sawman couldn't get his rifle up fast enough.

    Even with my shorter oal setup and trying not to come in contact with the buggy frame, I always manage to hit the frame once or more times per night. A Tavor with suppressor mounted will be about 3-4" shorter than what I have now. My new suppressor, due in my hands next week, will cut around 2" off my oal. I have thought about wrapping an oven mitt around my suppressor to act as a anti metal to metal contact device. Since I'm not driving, I alternate between having my firearm pointed to the right or pointing up and angled slightly forward. Using my bathroom scale, my setup weighs 10 pounds (rifle, suppressor, thermal, day optic, loaded mag)...no wonder my arms are a little sore after night hunting. I do have a shorter 300BLK upper (8" bbl Vs 9.5" bbl) and may try it to see how well it works with the new suppressor.

    Funny the lengths we gun nuts go to "justify" a new purchase. Oh well, enjoy life.
     

    Dan1612

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    Do you guys ever guide? It sounds like a blast!
     
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